The state of gaming today.. GTA clones and Piss weak driving games

[notorious HSG]

I just wanted to ask people what they think of the games coming out of late... I for one am sick to death of shit games like NFS and GTA clones...Yeh the first Fast and Furious film wasnt too bad.. but its spawned countless games that quite frankly are CRAP... pathetic driving physics doesnt add up to a good game.. Is it simply because Im and old fart (32) or what..
GTA also had its day... but its DONE... how many copies are we going to see..
Whatever happened to originality?? Every thing is re-hashed, remixed.. cant anyone come out with something new..

If the DS is anything to go by.. i will buy a Wii.. there are some friggin bizarre games on the nintendo systems...

anyway ive had my winge ... let the flaming begin

[guttermouth]

Indeed, the gamming industry resembles Hollywood, companies don't want to take gambles on new ideas and just seem to make shit that they know will sell.

[Gameboffin]

Whilst I agree with some of your post mate, I disagree that NFS is shit (I quite enjoyed Most Wanted) and that GTA has had its day.

Just remember that GTA represented an important shift in video games - from a linear structure to a sandbox, free-form game world where missions take place in areas that are already existant. You aren't transported to walled-in levels but are given free reign to explore how to complete a mission with all of the elements available to you. This freedom was a breath of fresh air for games and while I agree that there are some pretty crap clones available - and I'm sorry but Saints Row is looking to be one of them - I disagree that the innovations offered by GTA are by all means over and done with.

I am excited about the possibilites of true integration of a living city with both interior and exterior locations, level deformation and, hopefully, more realistic AI which further immerses you into a game's created world.

However, I think your post is more about being frustrated with the way developers are simply going for the easy buck and riding off the back of established and successful franchises - I do agree with you on that and unfortunately it's the money that talks and, whether or not we like it, a lot of us gamers do buy these games when they get released - further enforcing the cycle of shit games and unoriginality.

I like to think that its all about percentages - original and innovative games are always going to come along, but they may only be about 10% of new games. However, even if all the copies and shit games weren't released I think the percentage would still be the same, we'd just have less filler to play with. So, in some ways you can't FORCE originality, it's a process that takes time and talented individuals and developers to hone their skills in the art of making games. That said, I can't wait for the next GTA :D

[Shane]

Wow some of you kids have short memories.. if you think that GTA was the first 'sandbox / free form / non linear' series of video games i suggest a quick google for games such as Elite from 20+ years ago on the commodore 64. anyhooo...

But your frustration at how publishers today buy up movie licence IP or just continue with sequel after sequel is totally accurate and this was confirmed at the recent Activision Activate event that Dominic and I went to. there's not just a reluctance, but a out and out fear, mixed with a tinge of laziness, to invest in new IP these days.

It's sad to say it, but i seriously doubt if we'll ever see new genres of games any more so be prepared to still be buying fps, tps, sports, racing and platformers 20 years from now. Sure, some new games might have something new and cool to do, but if being able to swing a massive linked sword to strangle enemies, or now being able to wrestle the weapons out of some Nazi's hands is the culmination of 2-3 years development time and 15 million dollars, then that time's been wasted. But, that game will sell millions of copies, further reinforcing the bean counters opinion and mantra to then make yet another sequel instead of turning some of that profit back into new ideas.

What's even worse is that when a new game in an established series comes out, all thats usually added on is more content or some gimmicky new feature instead trying to improve or push the genre even further forward than the first game may have. Sure, gta was mega popular, so the sequels stick to the formula that worked for the first game, but many frustrating elements continue through each release and legitimate fan complaints or problems inherient to that games genre (eg, 3d cameras, third person shooting) are never addressed.

Even the menus for similar options accross games still differs, some games use Y to cancel cut scenes, some use B, some use A.. wtf is up with that? Even Microsoft have dropped the ball in many aspects in unifying the GUI/operational experience when using the 360. Sure the new dashboard is great, but they also need to push dev teams harder to make all operations inside game menus as similar as possible accross games... but, back on topic.. excuse the rant.

Anyway, if this frustrates you already, i suggest you just hang out for the games like Mass Effect etc that, while in an established genre, have a development team behind it not afraid to spend time making the experience better in each game they make. If you cant wait, or are that pissed off already and growing cynical to the point where you'll ignore games in genres you enjoy, then it may be time for many of us to find another form of entertainment to spend our time with.

I love the 360, it's got a, yes small number, of great games on it, but if it wasn't for cheapo live arcade stuff such as Uno, it would be a borderline failure imho... The new dash and the Xbox live / live arcade experience are just about the only thing offering anything new to Xbox gamers.

I'm sorry to contribute to a negative post/thread, but i've been feeling a growing level of cynicism in myself and many other gamers lately all tired of where the industry is heading and nobody wants to see it stagnate and implode upon itself.

[sketch]

I love it when gam developers break from the norm. Like Ubisoft with 'Beyond Good And Evil' and Sony with 'Ico'. Should definetly be done more.

[munki]

woot BGE rocks socks

[Baz]

GTA is still far better than anything else that has been thrown at it

[Tap Twist Snap]

Need for speed most wanted is still one of the most enjoyable games i've played sure the graphics don't really have a wow factor but the gameplay is great. I had it on xbox and sold it and got it again on 360. I'll agree ea don't put alot of effort in bringing new things to the table but to say most wanted is crap isn't fair. As for the GTA games i played them all and got bored with them all pretty quickly. So in the end it's all about taste. The 360 really renewed my interest in games after getting pretty bored with what I could get on the original xbox. I'm all for new genres but does anyone really have any ideas of something that would be good and not just a gimmick.

[Baz]

Carbon is looking good, no body kits this time around so they say. Just engine modifications and suspention, spoilers, paint jobs etc i guess

[Unrealsteve]

I'm all for new genres but does anyone really have any ideas of something that would be good and not just a gimmick.

Ye, I can't really think of anything that could be branded a new 'genre'.

What do people want? a first person platformer? Anything can be put under the genres we already have.

[Darksheer]

I agree, but I don’t think accessories like magic wand controllers and touch pads are going to fix the situation by themselves. It can already be seen that the Wii is going to be flooded with ports of games we have already played (i.e. FarCry)… Creative ideas, story, and imagination are seriously missing from what we are seeing. However, copies of the tried-and-true are to be expected. Mind you it does seem that new IP is diminishing more alarmingly than desired… at least this is how it is being perceived. This year has been a terrible one for new talent being released for the X360, However there may not be any reason to at this stage. The release of the Wii and the PS3 (whenever that is) should provide sufficient reason for MS to let the floodgates open a little.

This reminds me, what was the first year of the Xbox like? Were there heaps of titles and innovative one?

[munki]

Maybe everyones just run out of ideas?

[Dominus]

What the industry needs is more superpower developers forming blocs like Bioware/Pandemic...those guys can make whatever the hell they want and take as long as they damn well please, and publishers will clamour for it even if they don't get to own the IP involved because these guys are big bucks. Some like Blizzard can stand on their own, but if we see more developers attempting to band together and shake up the industry model a bit, I think we'll see less sequelitis than we will if EA continues to dominate the market.

All that said, I don't find myself especially cynical in general, I think there's enough stuff coming to the 360 in future that is new and fresh to be a good indicator of more to come...Mass Effect, Too Human, Viva Pinata, the list goes on. Sure, none are truly "original" but you can argue for days about whether you can ever come up with something really new and unique.

Am I happy with the state of the industry? not really, but I'm not disgusted or anything yet either. The next 2 years will probably be the most telling...if we see MS open the XBLA open to garage/indie developers even more, it may be the perfect delivery system for the Darwinia's of the world to really take a stand. I also hope that the next few years will spell the death of shoddy, piss-poor ports of titles since the 360 and PS3 are so much closer in terms of specifications.

But time will tell I guess. Hang in there HSG, I wouldn't give up on gaming yet.

[TalkieToaster]

The thing is, as technology improved, new avenues of inovation continued to open up. 3D wasn't feasable 20 years ago, but now it's the norm, But where can we go from here? New systems come out, and they offer better graphics and more processing power, but not much else. But this is like any form of entertainment, everything's been done, and it's very rare to see any real inovation. What needs to be done is the fine tuning of everything. Doing something, putting the care and effort into a game to make it truly remarkable. Unfortunately, this means longer developement times, which in turn means more cost. So if the game bombs, developers are out of a lot more money than if they throw together a cheap knock off of another game, using a stock-standard engine. And just like everything else, no one with money wants to take that risk.

[michael39]

We'll just have to wait for virtual reality games to kick in....but seriously there has been alot of clones its just a matter of picking out the good ones from the bad ones....

[E-Vader]

Maybe my thinking is totally of tangent but my thoughts anyway...

The games industry this day seems to be more "money" orientated than it used to be so sequals and tried and true formula will prevail, No one really want's to go out on a limb anymore to create that something special when failure means going out of business.

It used to be the smaller companies that created the groundbreaking games, Remember when Id first started or Origin even Ion Storm, There seemed to be a higher level of creativity then than now since the big guys either brought out the smaller guys or just outright crushed them.

[TalkieToaster]

Exactly. And the smaller guys just don't have the finance to create the type of games that people expect to see on the current systems.

[Geezer]

[QUOTE=Shane]Wow some of you kids have short memories.. if you think that GTA was the first 'sandbox / free form / non linear' series of video games i suggest a quick google for games such as Elite from 20+ years ago on the commodore 64. anyhooo...


Good post Shane.

I have to agree with you and the OP. I've been gaming on and off since the Commodore64 days and the games industry I believe has taken a turn for the worse. Few if any publishers seem willing to produce anything fresh these days and really we've only ourselves to blame.
The people want shiny graphics running at 300 fps and they don't want to have to think too hard while they're at it. I mean really, how many times is that guy going to single handedly repel the entire alien fleet with his oversized plasma cannon.

This quest for the shiniest FPS has driven game development costs through the roof, and can you blame the publishers for not wanting to take too many risks when millions of dollars investment are involved.
Whats gone down however is the content being offered to us for our $100-$120. What's the average game knock-over time these days? 8-10 hours.

Entire genres have dried up or drying up, SIMS, RPG's, graphic adventure, turn based games, space games and god forbid, anything with the word strategy anywhere near it is a death sentence these days.

Two of my favoutite games from last last few years were Space Rangers and Evil Genious. (Both PC). Both games no-one has ever heard of as they were produced by smaller publishers and were made on shoe string budgets, yet to me were great because they had the missing element, gameplay.

RPG's have always been my 'thing' but that genre has been dumbed down to little more than FPS style beat 'em' ups. I liked Oblivion for a while, but then I realised after the pretty graphics wore off how shallow and repetative it really is. Can we please have FALLOUT3 PLEASE!!!

*sigh* I think I'm going to go load up Day of the Tentacle.

[Droll]

If you don't like them don't play them. I, for one, still enjoy a lot of games and I'm 35. I admit I am a little jaded of FPS games, which is no surprise considering how many I've played in the last 10 years or so, but occasionally one will come along and pique my interest. I also find Saints Row to be sufficiently different, despite 'borrowing' a whole slew of elements from that famous series, to be considered it's own game, and quite a good one if people actually spend some time on it.

So, go fire up your text adventures, play some pacman or save the chick from the pixellated gorilla and marvel at the 'gameplay'. Those games held my attention for hours at a time back in the day. Of course I didn't have many more gaming options and if I played them now I'd be nostalgically excited for maybe fifteen minutes then I'd get bored and go for something more immersive.

Of course if you're too jaded with gaming do something else with your time - it was a beautiful day today and worth a few hours in the sun.

[Shane]

*sigh* I think I'm going to go load up Day of the Tentacle.

yer that's one thing thats missing nowdays... good old fashioned 2d adventuring filled with whacky humour.

bring on DotT 2, Sam and Max 2, Full Throttle 2, Fandango 2... at least then we'd have a sequel worthy of a hundred buck purchase.

there was a sequel to Full Throttle in the works for Xbox but it got canned a few years ago :(

if i won one of those 200$ million type of U.S lotteries i'd fund a Sam and Max 2 game myself :D

[Lord Fistus]

i suggest a quick google for games such as Elite from 20+ years ago on the commodore 64
Ah, that brings back memories :thumbsup: :D

i suggest you just hang out for the games like Mass Effect
I'd love to see a Freelancer style game on the 360, with :xbl:Live:xbl: support of course. Open ended, free flowing, but with a stronger RPG element. But perhaps not as strong as Mass Effect. There should be a balance between RP and flight/combat.

[Shakey-Lo]

no need shane

http://www.telltalegames.com/samandmax

[Jamie]

I dont mind the current state of gaming. The FPS has been my favorite genre since Wolfenstein 3D, and the games just keep getting more realistic.

Im not really happy about the state of 360 gaming though. pretty much all we have is a bunch of PC and Xbox ports.

[Shane]

no need shane

http://www.telltalegames.com/samandmax

ahhhhhhhhhhhh excellent :D thanks Shakey-Lo :D

[Kingn1ck]

The GTA games are good games but I never was a huge fan, the aspect I liked most about them was the music.

[Tsargrad]

I must say I'm happy with the state of gaming, but my mainly genre is sporting titles. I'm happy for my yearly updates of kits, squads and minor gaming tweaks.

[Unrealsteve]

no need shane

http://www.telltalegames.com/samandmax

Does this mean its been resurrected again? They were making a S&M2 for the original xbox but it got canned same time as full throttle 2. Is this an entirely new game?

I'd love to see a Freelancer style game on the 360, with Live support of course. Open ended, free flowing, but with a stronger RPG element. But perhaps not as strong as Mass Effect. There should be a balance between RP and flight/combat.

I loved freelancer and always wanted it to come out on the original xbox. I'd love to see a sequel to it.

[notorious HSG]

But time will tell I guess. Hang in there HSG, I wouldn't give up on gaming yet.

hahah... nah mate I'll be hangin around for a long time. I love my games.. but I just needed to vent a little frustration. As alot of other people have mentioned there are some promising titles coming out.. GOW, Mass Effect and especially Bioshock.. that game has my undivided attention.

[Kingn1ck]

Instead of focusing on the negative why not focus on the positive.

Despite the fact there's a lot of average games out and probablya lot more to come for the 360 upcoming games like Halo 3 and Bioshock totally sold the 360 for me.

[Shakey-Lo]

yeah unrealsteve the sam and max game was resurrected. I'm not sure what the deal with this gametap business is... does that mean we have to subscribe to it in order to get sam and max?

[killer1500]

Im actually starting to get sick of First Person Shooters recently. I struggle to finish most games, even the good ones, simply because of boredom.

I also beleive the Halo series extremly over-rated, especially if you dont play Halo 2 for the multiplayer.

[munki]

bring on DotT 2, Sam and Max 2, Full Throttle 2, Fandango 2... at least then we'd have a sequel worthy of a hundred buck purchase.



ahem.... Monkey Island 5

[Morph]

ahem.... Monkey Island 5

monkey island 5? last i heard, lucasarts had confirmed they are not working on MI5.

[mr_bagel]

I think the problem is that to many developers are catering to the the mainstream audience and not the hardcore audience.
the mainstream don't care about innovation, they just want names they know and games that involve pressing the the direction up, down ect to move and pressing R1 to shoot, if the mainstream don't understand the game within the first 10 minutes then they will abandon it and spread the word that its bad.
how many people do you know who aren't really big gamers and their collection of games consist of GTA, NFS and some EA sports titles? im betting the majority.
the problem is mainstream is were the money is made but with the videogames business picking up steam and growing hopefully one day the hardcore audience will be big enough for devs to take a risk and do something different.
hardcore have the ability to look at something and see what it could of been rather than what it is, if something in a game didn't work out and knowing that the new feature has potential they will wait untill the sequal to see if the feature is all that it could of been so bombing out with something new with the hardore audience won't be as big a deal because the hardcore audience will more than likely want the developer to have another shot at it.

in case you don't want to read my whole post i will summarize.
unless the hardcore audience grows you won't see any games stepping of the already layed out path.

Now that im finished its time for the best part of posting, spell checking

[Paranoid666au]

Well it's always been my thought that there too many dumb people in the world that are all to happy to revel in the sh t that gets shovelled to them.

[Shane]

Well it's always been my thought that there too many dumb people in the world that are all to happy to revel in the sh t that gets shovelled to them.

LOL well thats true of every entertainment medium :)

[Paranoid666au]

Yea certainly is. Maybe most people don't care. I like a good game but maybe the next person couldn't care. Maybe all people want is a little tickle to keep the neurons ticking over and there happy. I say they all need to be shot :D

[Droll]

On the flipside, there are mainstream games worthy of the attention of any gamer, but they get shunned by 'hardcore' gamers because of elitist snobbery. Anyway, since we're getting into generalised statements, I don't see how anyone can consider a console as being 'hardcore'.

[notorious HSG]

On the flipside, there are mainstream games worthy of the attention of any gamer, but they get shunned by 'hardcore' gamers because of elitist snobbery. Anyway, since we're getting into generalised statements, I don't see how anyone can consider a console as being 'hardcore'.

huh?.. consoles and PC's arnt hardcore.. they are hardware... PEOPLE are hardcore..

[Droll]

huh?.. consoles and PC's arnt hardcore.. they are hardware... PEOPLE are hardcore..

I was being sarcastic - contrasting the comments made here that 'games aren't being made for hardcore gamers' and another common generalisation made by purely PC gamers that 'consoles aren't hardcore'.

[notorious HSG]

I was being sarcastic - contrasting the comments made here that 'games aren't being made for hardcore gamers' and another common generalisation made by purely PC gamers that 'consoles aren't hardcore'.

Ok.. I see. Its very difficult to understand emotion, sarcasm etc with text...

[AJMitchell]

Flame on! whoooooooooooshhhhh

There haven't been that many clones at all, barely more than five for GTA and NFS each that I can think of. Which hardly seems a glut of clones to me. Most of those games have either appeared and died as a result of simply being poor (True Crime NY) or done well as a result of offering something new within an established genre (Mercenaries).

Mean while there are new types of games coming out all the time, not just within the confines of the console controller either, look at Eye toy, Buzz and Guitar Hero. Admittedly the PS2 has been a damn site more experimental than the Xbox.

I'm pretty happy with the games industry right now and am eagerly looking forward to a number of upcoming 'sequals' and 'clones' of past games.

Its certainly not so bad to get your knickers in a twist over! If the clone games where taking something away from the development of other new games it would be, but that doesn't seem to be the case.

[Darksheer]

re Hardcore: Yeah I found out today that I am not a hardcore gamer, because I am not apart of the PlayStation generation. I feel so empty.:cry:

[Morph]

i think we are seeing a lot more "clones" is because game development costs have sky rocketed and developers are less likely to take risks. they want to stick with a formula that has worked well for them and others in the past and is a sure way of making money

[gta3freak_2001]

The current GTA games have ended(excluding VCS), San Andreas hit a wall for me as far as the series goes. Only because the hardware of the time couldn't offer much more to the series. With GTA4 I think its going to be able to be fresh, as fresh as it was when GTA3 came out. The power of the RAGE engine combined with hardware like the PS3 and Xbox 360 will let GTA expand to its full potential.

[arbok]

Totally agree with you notorious HSG

what about adding the EA yearly sports update series into your rant as well or is that a whole other issue?

[notorious HSG]

Totally agree with you notorious HSG

what about adding the EA yearly sports update series into your rant as well or is that a whole other issue?

hell yeh... i thought that would go without saying:chortle:

[Droll]

EA have been doing that for years - you can't really refer to it as the state of gaming today